Re: strace broken in 7.0?

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Thus "Paul B. Mahol" <onemda_at_gmail.com> spake on Thu, 10 Jan 2008
19:34:45 +0000:

> Strace from ports on 8.0 current works without problems.

Part of the discussion on bsdforen.de was some people complaining that
parts of the base system (as well as [important] ports) do not work,
and are maintained very badly due to 'no interest'.

As already appeared in this discussion here, it would be nice to be
more 'conservative'; this word has it's origin in latin language, com
servare, to preserve; "to protect from loss or harm".

So a 'conservative development model' (the BSDs where typically known
for) leads to a well functioning environment. The only BSD I know of
where this really *is* the case is OpenBSD. NetBSD, e.g., had times
where their tree didn't build (especially for me between 3.99.3 and
3.99.15 on macppc). FreeBSD has a damn high number of open/unfixed PRs,
and people complain more and more that this harms them in several ways.

Nobody wants to rant, it's just about _improvement_. Improvement, or
the idea of how to improve something (FreeBSD), needs user feedback.
This is a fact that should be known by every developer/coder/hacker on
this planet (but obviously isn't, as one can experience almost every
day).

The problem here is that some developers don't get this. They think
someone wants to rant or p*ss them off. *This* is a real problem.

I've been using NetBSD and OpenBSD for almost 15 years now (I joined
very early), FreeBSD for almost nine or ten years.

During this period of time, unfortunately, only OpenBSD kept its
promises. They are really strong with their ideals, but suffer from
other problems (bad performance, bad SMP stack, and a jackass leader).

NetBSD has (had?) a problem to justify its very close relationship to
Wasabi Systems, Inc.

FreeBSD seems to decay from release to release; don't get me wrong, I
*do* like new features, enhances SMP, ZFS, all this stuff, no problem.
*BUT* please don't forget the basis. It wouldn't surprise me if ls(1)
doesn't work when 8.0 is released. This is a real problem. Version
numbering is absolutely unimportant. FreeBSD has a phantastic
reputation as super stable (server) OS. This is absolutely independent
from both version numbers and features implemented.

Wearing my license-ignoring head, 'if I want features, I run Linux'.

Seriously. Up to now, we only use BSD-based software in-house or at
customers, or we use commercial Unices (AIX, Solaris, et al).

We don't like Linux. But with the rate of decay of the last months and
years almost throughout the BSD family, we're forced to go commercial.

Set OpenBSD aside, I feel a gigantic lack of leadership.

> BTW, have a nice day.

Thanks, have a nice day, too. :)

Best regards,

Timo

> On 1/10/08, Timo Schoeler <timo.schoeler_at_riscworks.net> wrote:
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> > Thus Julian Elischer <julian_at_elischer.org> spake on Thu, 10 Jan 2008
> > 10:59:54 -0800:
> >
> > > Tom Evans wrote:
> > > > On Thu, 2008-01-10 at 18:11 +0100, Philippe Audéoud wrote:
> > > >> On Thu, 10 Jan 2008, Unga wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>> Hi all
> > > >>>
> > > >>> strace (v4.5.5) works well in 6.2. But strace (v4.5.6)
> > > >>> develops following error in 7.0-PRERELEASE:
> > > >>> $ strace pwd
> > > >>> execve(0xbfbfe92c, [0xbfbfedf4], [/* 0 vars
> > > >>> */]PIOCWSTOP: Input/output error
> > >
> > >
> > > and the reason you don't use ktrace is..?
> >
> > I tried to hide, really. But this is a perfect example of what the
> > bsdforen.de discussion is about.
> >
> > q.e.d.
> >
> > timo

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