Re: DDB patches

> A template for blackmailing is usually in the form:
> 
> "I will do this (usually involving saving the world and/or your
> evidently miserable life) but first you will have to do this
> (unrelated) thing to see that you are worthy.”


It is interesting how much you dwell on this.  I just told you what reasons 
I have to take this path, and that it doesn't include the intent to blackmail 
anyone. I want to experience the process with already existing code, 
before contemplating more in the future. Is this:
 1. So hard to understand ?
 2. Wrong in the eyes of god, or something ?

Leaving aside saving the world, and / or miserable lives , damsels in distress and other 
fantasies, you will just have to  accept what I said, instead of insisting you know better what
is in my head. 

> . You can try.. but there will likely
> be pain.

You see this from a very interesting angle. I am not trying to change you or your community. 
No sane person would do that,  knowing how powerful social forces are. Do you really think
I would embark on such a fool’s errand ? I told you, I like to spend time with walking with my dog :P 
What I am trying to determine where to position myself. 

> That doesn't mean everyone is happy with it or that it is perfect
> but it went in through an open process. 

Ill take your word for it. But in my opinion the result of this open process is that:
1. A distasteful solution was adopted into the base. 
2. Still people think that it was adopted only because someone had the code (Juniper)
3. While others seems to think Junpier ppl pushed it (Im not saying they did, 
but you can certainly push something pressing the correct political buttons.

> You can experiment on your own without waiting on us to decide:
> eventually we may decide to bring it in …

You tell me nothing new, but thank you.



> On 20 Nov 2015, at 17:56, Pedro Giffuni <pfg_at_FreeBSD.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> On 11/20/15 08:54, Dan Partelly wrote:
>> Hi Pedro,
>> 
>> I think you confuse blackmailing with something much simpler and pragmatic.
>> One needs to asses how things work in your project for real before investing
>> too much time.
>> 
> 
> A template for blackmailing is usually in the form:
> 
> "I will do this (usually involving saving the world and/or your
> evidently miserable life) but first you will have to do this
> (unrelated) thing to see that you are worthy."
> 
>> Adrian was contemplating the fact that none writes code,  so I had some code at the
>> hand with with I can see how things work around here. You want it, good.
>> You don't want it, its also good.
> 
> I don't know about the (new) libxo discussion, but the ddb thing is unrelated to such discussion, and when I first looked at it it was
> not in good shape.
> 
> You want to trash it… also good.
>> Its all the same to me. This process is aimed to  give me an idea , if your workflow
>> works for me.
>> 
> 
> In my experience it is always easier for new contributors to adapt to
> the community than to re-shape it. You can try.. but there will likely
> be pain.
> 
> 
>> 
>>> you discuss your idea and try to get some consensus in the lists/IRC/conferences.
>> 
>> I am not particularly interested in promoting ideas and gathering consensus. I am not a
>> politician. I happen to believe that translating some utilities from the  base to libraries
>>  is a very valuable  addition to the project. Id rather spend time with my familty and walk
>> around the city in nature with my GSD dog than embarking on some twisted political
>> campaign.
>> 
>>> We are particularly NOT interested in code where the original contributor will walk
>>> away as soon as he/she receives criticism or has plans that do not match ours.
>> 
>> Undeerstandable.
>> 
>>> 
>>> Libxo already went through this process.
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>>>> Libxo already went through this process.
>> 
>> It did, aint it ? And I seen what kind of “consensus” the xoification of base
>> caused. Apparently, adopted for no better reason than “someone wrote code” .
>> 
> 
> 
> There was a GSoC that did a different implementation but libxo was
> specifically made for FreeBSD after a long discussion.
> 
> That doesn't mean everyone is happy with it or that it is perfect
> but it went in through an open process. The process, call it politics
> or consensus or community building, is important in any opensource
> effort that aims to be sustainable.
> 
> These days github makes it pretty easy for anyone to play with their
> new ideas to the limit. When I mean you can fork your own BSD, I
> mean it. You can experiment on your own without waiting on us to decide:
> eventually we may decide to bring it in ...
> 
> Pedro.