Re: drm / drm2 removal in 12

I think you can pay XinuOS to support FreeBSD in a LTS situation.
It is just like linux where you have to pay Red Hat, Suse, etc.
They break things even with point releases. Suse majorly
screwed with video drivers back in the 9.x series. Totally
broke major release. Their answer then was pay us or
re-install bare metal and figure it out on your own.
Other wise linux has always been, you get what you get for free.
BSD is the same. If you are lucky some one like red hat, suse, XinuOS
will be supporting and make their notes public, otherwise the
OSS model doesn't include anything more than community support
for what ever that is worth.
I just upgraded a system from FreeBSD 9.x to 12.x, it took 2 weeks and
several incremental upgrades sometimes to multiple point releases
with in a major release. There is nothing really for free.


On 8/25/2018 7:47 PM, blubee blubeeme wrote:
> On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 8:16 AM Johannes Lundberg <johalun0_at_gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>
>> On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 00:25 blubee blubeeme <gurenchan_at_gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 2:08 AM Dag-Erling Smørgrav <des_at_des.no> wrote:
>>>
>>>> blubee blubeeme <gurenchan_at_gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> True on both points my tone is just a reflection of attitudes of the
>>>>> individuals that I am currently addressing.
>>>> Well, congratulations on alienating absolutely everybody you have
>>>> interacted with on this topic.
>>>>
>>>>> Some people enjoy making contributions w/o waving a banner constantly
>>>>> wanting acknowledgement, a pat on the head and good job from everyone.
>>>> The only person I see constantly craving attention and validation from
>>>> others here is you.
>>>>
>>>>> How far will core FreeBSD bend over backwards to accommodate these
>>>>> devs.
>>>> The core team does not decide what goes into the tree or not.  The
>>>> developers do.
>>>>
>>>>> This is the beauty of an open source project, we bring the best to the
>>>>> table, [...]
>>>> Who exactly is “we” here?  You are not a member of the project, you do
>>>> not speak for the project, and after seeing how you treat our fellow
>>>> developers, our friends, most of us want nothing to do with you.  If
>>>> can't live with that, I'm sure you can figure out how to install Linux.
>>>>
>>>> DES
>>>> --
>>>> Dag-Erling Smørgrav - des_at_des.no
>>>
>>> Some on here want to attack my personality because they think that I am
>>> abrasive, fine but that's not the issue.
>>>
>>> Some claim that they run the code and it works wonderful for them with no
>>> issues, again that's lovely keep on running the code.
>>>
>>>   Nevertheless let me restate the point that you guys are all seeming to
>>> miss; If you can go out and build custom kernels with custom options and
>>> out of mainline tree that's fine, keep doing that until you have something
>>> that's production ready and as easy to install as the rest of FreeBSD
>>> system.
>>>
>>> The graphics stack on FreeBSD is pretty bad as it stands but all the
>>> documentation currently out there is about using it as it stands now.
>>>
>>> Why do you need to rip out the current graphics drivers which will break
>>> systems for the vast majority of silent users who will not complain and
>>> just leave?
>>>
>>> ---- A little background ----
>>> Do you know why Samsung, Motorola, Sony, LG, Nokia, etc... never update
>>> their phones to the latest android version?
>>>
>>> It's because the Linux kernel is such a mess they know it's a waste of
>>> resources to try. You should not have to ask how or why I know this but if
>>> it's unclear I was in the field.
>>> -----------------------------------
>>>
>>> Now you guys who claim to only be hobbyist doing this in their free time
>>> expect to maintain this when those companies with all their resources
>>> cannot?
>>>
>>> Those 30,000 ports many of them bring bugs with them because of this
>>> Linuxkpi stuff. Just recently there was a user who said google earth
>>> doesn't work the answer was it doesn't work and that's that.
>>>
>>> They get ported and then get dropped so while the ports tree is large, if
>>> you actually try to use some of those programs they are broken,
>>> maintenance
>>> hell for the developers and confusion for the users.
>>>
>>> Johannes Lundberg I know that you are one of the main working on this
>>> linuxkpi stuff but anyone else is free to answer as well.
>>>
>>> Let's have an open discussion why do you need to remove the current
>>> graphics stack to continue with your work?
>>
>> This has been discussed over and over on the mailing list and I don’t
>> think anyone wants to do it over again so please feel free to search the
>> archives.
>>
>> You’re misinformed. We are not removing anything for anyone. We are moving
>> it to ports.
>> “pkg install drm-legacy-kmod” will install those drivers for you that were
>> earlier in base. I thought we have been clear about this but maybe we
>> haven’t been clear enough.
>>
>>
>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> "
>>>
>> Have you or anyone working on this drm-legacy-kmod stuff done any testings
> of how this will affect current users?
>
> 1) Take a [test] system with the current graphics stack installed and
> working.
> 2) Apply your patches to remove the drm from base to create a port
> 3) update the working [test] system after applying your changes
>
> How does your changes affect a [test] system that is already up and running?
>
> Have any of you guys tried that? Do you have any documentation on how it'll
> affect users.
>
> You guys want to remove things from the current system but you come with;
> it works for us hobbyists.
> Where do users go to get steps to do all of this stuff?
>
> You've repeatedly said what you want to do sure, but have you tested it?
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