Re: FreeBSD Core Team Response to Controversial Social Media Posts

So you think a discussion on whether it is appropriate that CoC Ctte
restricts freedom of expression is bikeshedding?

Thank you for your valuable contribution!

-- 
Igor M.

On Mon, 20 May 2019 at 06:23, Daniel Braniss wrote:
>
> BIKE SHED SYNDROME?
>
> danny
> PS: intentionally top posting :-)
>
> > On 19 May 2019, at 22:43, Igor Mozolevsky wrote:
> >
> > On Sun, 19 May 2019 at 20:16, Warner Losh wrote:
> >>
> >> On Sun, May 19, 2019 at 11:34 AM Igor Mozolevsky wrote:
> >>>
> >>> On Sun, 19 May 2019 at 17:54, Warner Losh wrote:
> >
> > <snip>
> >
> >>>> Yes. There will always be limits, just like in real life. You can't tell
> >>>> fire in a theater, and claim freedom of expression, for example.
> >>>
> >>> <snip>
> >>>
> >>> While that is an often cited example, it is rather tenuous as far as
> >>> "freedom of expression" is concerned: yelling "Fire!" in a crowded
> >>> theatre is by no measure an expression of one's views, thoughts, or
> >>> opinions. At the same time, the invocation of a CoC ctte review is
> >>> triggered by precisely the latter.
> >>
> >>
> >> It is a difficult problem. The project needs to protect itself and its
> >> members from harm. Sometimes, though rarely, that harm
> >> comes from expressing ones views in a way that's so extreme
> >> it causes real and lasting problems either for the cohesiveness
> >> of the project, or its effect on the project's reputation is so
> >> extreme, people can't separate the two and stop using it. There
> >> needs to be a review mechanism for cases that are extreme.
> >
> > It's very difficult to subscribe to that view! The first problem you
> > encounter is "what is an objectively extreme expression"--what is
> > extreme to one, might be entirely common place to another. I'm sure
> > whatever religious book one takes there is a passage that goes along
> > the lines of "judge people by their deeds not by their words"...
> > Secondly, the greatest legal minds in the US wrangled with that and
> > came up with one answer: *ANY* expression is protected for otherwise
> > it would not be "freedom."
> >
> >
> >> At the same time, reviews are detrimental if they are triggered
> >> for 'ordinary' conduct: they take time and energy away from
> >> the project that could otherwise be spent on making things
> >> better. The trick is to have any such review reflect the broad
> >> consensus within the project of what's clearly out of bounds,
> >> as well as having a fair and just response by the board in
> >> the cases that require some action.
> >
> >
> > Agreement by consensus is most dangerous, for, usually, the loudest
> > wins because people with no backbone fall in-line; the best
> > explanation of democracy I have ever heard was: "two wolves and a
> > sheep deciding what to have for dinner!"