On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 11:47 AM Gleb Popov <arrowd_at_freebsd.org> wrote: > > > > On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 2:28 PM Dima Pasechnik <dimpase+freebsd_at_gmail.com> wrote: >> >> On Sat, May 11, 2019 at 3:25 PM Julian H. Stacey <jhs_at_berklix.com> wrote: >> > >> > FreeBSD Core Team Secretary wrote: >> > > The FreeBSD Core Team is aware of recent controversial statements made >> > > on social media by a FreeBSD developer. We, along with the Code of >> > > Conduct review committee, are investigating the matter and will decide >> > > what action to take. Both the Core Team and the FreeBSD Foundation >> > > would like to make it clear that views shared by individuals represent >> > > neither the Project nor the Foundation. >> > >> > Core_at_ statements always welcome. >> > >> > But Code of Conduct committee merit no automatic credence since: >> > >> > Code of Conduct aims were cloned from an ultra feminist group of >> > non FreeBSD members, part paid by foundation, then shoved on >> > FreeBSD before discussion, by a voluble few in FreeBSD >> >> The present matter has nothing to do with feminism. > > > I don't see who states that. > >> Anyway, as someone >> who has been chased upon by a gang of youths screaming "zhidovskaya >> morda" ("Jewish snout") (Moscow, USSR, circa 1975, tough >> neighbourhood, and well, I have a Jewish grandmother) I absolutely do >> not appreciate the sort of thoughtless "freedom of speech" blah blah, >> as far as expressions of hate towards particular ethnic groups are . > > > Just wondering how old were you and "haters" were. In my childhood I was laughed on because having too big ears, another girl - because she was fat, and another guy - because his dad was an alcoholic. I'd argue that being bulled by "jewish snout" words instead of "fatty" puts you in some special position amongst these people and me. > Yes, the phenomenom is bad in its nature, but it is also so common and insignificant, that IMO it doesn't serve all that fuss. My CV may be found online at the link after the signature - I am 56 y.o., and I did experience a fair share of state-amplified and condoned antisemitism back in USSR (apart from this incident). There was no state-condoned hate of people with big ears or excessive weight, and this does make quite some difference. As to "it is also so common" --- this is the 1st time in more than 27 years, since I left Moscow, that this topic interferes with my work. While it might be "so common" to you, it does not remove the hate from the hate speech it is. > >> Because they always incite violence. >> And yes, in USSR persons with ethnically Jewish parents had "Jew" >> written in their internal IDs (just like in Nazi Germany). Under this >> commonly accepted definition, saying "I hate Jews", as Mr. Kamp did on >> twitter, is full-blown racism, > > > I'd like to hear how it is "commonly accepted". I don't remember accepting anything related. Are you trying to tell us that "5th paragraph", ethnicity, never was present in internal USSR passports? Of course it was, and on the basis of this I dare to say that my definition was commonly accepted in the USSR. And in present days Europe "jew" need not refer to a religious affiliation. (about 40% of Israeli citizens describe themselves as secular, by the way). > >> and Mr. Kamp ought to offer an apology >> for this - while he does not do it in >> http://phk.freebsd.dk/sagas/israel/ >> >> While in some jurisdictions hate speech is legally protected, it does >> not take away the hate in hate speech, and people generally don't like >> being hated. Hate originating from a freebsd.* domain is not good for >> the project. > > > freebsd.* domain can be registered by any individual, so hate originating from such domains can't (well, shouldn't) affect the project in any way. > On the contrary, hate originating from *.freebsd.org, it does affect the project. Luckily, this is not the case. > >> >> Let me point few things in the latter: >> >> * there is nothing like "the jewish religion" - there is a religion >> called Judaism, as Mr. Kamp ought to understand before >> making statements on these. Everyone can convert to Judaism, by the way. > > > Thanks for valuable information. It is completely off-topic and I doubt anyone here have any interest in this. As Mr. Kamp's blog post is being discussed here, I felt it might be appropriate to point out why it was an attempt to whitewash hate speech, rather than an explanation of an innocent misunderstanding. Regards, Dima > >> >> * Jews who are not Israeli citizens are about as responsible for >> policies of Israel as descendants of Vikings are responsible for >> policies of Scandinavian states of today. >> >> * I don't know anything about the legal status of the domain >> "freebsd.dk" --- nevertheless I don't think it does do much good to >> the reputation of FreeBSD to have these slightly illiterate writings >> there (although it might be bringing Mr.Kamp lucrative contracts from >> such pillars of democracy and free thought and speech as Saudi Arabia, >> Syria, and Iran :-)) >> >> Best, >> Dima >> http://users.ox.ac.uk/~coml0531/ >> >> >> >> >> > >> > The new CoC terms were hotly disputed. core_at_ failed to remove it >> > before many tuned out, despairing of the politics [& lack of core_at_ >> > backbone, probably themselves scared of being labeled anti-whatever], >> > >> > New CoC putch-ists took seats on CoC >> > >> > FreeBSD had a CoC before the putch with the new feminist etc CoC. >> > https://www.freebsd.org/internal/code-of-conduct.html >> > CoC could be replaced with the old one from SVN, or from >> > https://web.archive.org/web/*/https://www.freebsd.org/internal/code-of-conduct.html >> > >> > Cheers, >> > Julian >> > -- >> > Julian Stacey, Consultant Systems Engineer, BSD Linux Unix, Munich Aachen Kent >> > http://stolenvotes.uk Brexit ref. stole votes from 700,000 Brits in EU. >> > Lies bought; Groups fined; 1.9 M young had no vote, 1.3 M old leavers died. >> > _______________________________________________ >> > freebsd-current_at_freebsd.org mailing list >> > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current >> > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe_at_freebsd.org" >> _______________________________________________ >> freebsd-current_at_freebsd.org mailing list >> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current >> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe_at_freebsd.org"Received on Tue May 21 2019 - 09:27:57 UTC
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