Re: Plans for git (was: Please check the current beta git conversions)

On Wed, Sep 2, 2020 at 12:36 PM Ian Lepore <ian_at_freebsd.org> wrote:

> On Wed, 2020-09-02 at 11:11 -0600, Warner Losh wrote:
> > On Wed, Sep 2, 2020 at 10:47 AM Steve Kargl <
> > sgk_at_troutmask.apl.washington.edu> wrote:
> >
> > > On Wed, Sep 02, 2020 at 12:14:08PM -0400, Ed Maste wrote:
> > > > On Wed, 2 Sep 2020 at 02:31, Steve Kargl
> > > > <sgk_at_troutmask.apl.washington.edu> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > A short intro on git for svn users:
> > > > > > https://hackmd.io/ML5TSl8mQ5-27B5eqDf7YA?view
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ROTFL.  From the "short intro", 2nd sentence.
> > > > >
> > > > > New committers are assumed to already be familiar with the
> > > > > basic
> > > > > operation of Git.  If not, start by reading the Git Book.
> > > >
> > > > This doc started as a direct translation of the Subversion
> > > > primer,
> > > > which has as its first sentence:
> > > > > New committers are assumed to already be familiar with the
> > > > > basic
> > >
> > > operation of Subversion. If not, start by reading the Subversion
> > > Book.
> > > >
> > > > As with the Subversion primer the doc is intended to provide a
> > > > quick
> > > > reference for day-to-day commands, but not act as a reference or
> > > > introduction to the entire theory of operation of the associated
> > > > VCS.
> > >
> > > Like GCC, which did the svn to git dance at start of the year,
> > > FreeBSD is throwing away a decade+ of corporate knowledge of
> > > working with svn and /usr/src.  What is needed is a succinct
> > > translation of the most common svn commands translated to git.
> > >
> > > Checking out /usr/src as user_at_freebsd.org
> > >
> > >   svn checkout svn+ssh://user_at_svn.freebsd.org/base/head /usr/src
> > >
> > >   git ...
> > >
> > > Checking out /usr/src without freebsd.org account
> > >
> > >   svn checkout https://svn.freebsd.org/base/head
> > > ${HOME}/freebsd/src
> > >
> > >   git ...
> > >
> > > Creating diff against updated head.
> > >
> > >   svn update
> > >   svn diff > patch.diff
> > >
> > >   git ...
> > >
> > > Adding a new file
> > >
> > >   svn add /usr/src/libm/msun/src/_s_sinpi.c
> > >
> > >   git ...
> > >
> > > Committing a change to /usr/src
> > >
> > >   svn update
> > >   svn diff <files-to-commit> | more (everyone does one last check,
> > > right?)
> > >   svn commit <files-to-commit>
> > >
> > >   git ...
> > >
> >
> > This is an insultingly stupid comment to make. We don't need people
> > to say
> > the obvious.
> >
> > This sort of comment isn't helpful. People will just ignore you if
> > you make
> > too many of them like it.
> >
>
> Seriously, Warner?
>
> I applaud Steve's message as being the first one in this thread that
> has any real value at all.  Unlike everyone else, he has clearly seen
> what the basic problem is (zero communications about this impending
> cutover to the people who need to work with it every day), and he
> summarized it in a completely practical way.
>
> This assumption that everyone knows how to use git is mind-boggling.  I
> think I installed it once, a few years ago.  Then I uninstalled it
> because of how abysmally hard it was to try to learn even a few
> commands to do anything with it.
>
> I guess Steve & I are a couple dinosaurs and the whole rest of the
> freebsd user and committer community is laughing at our ignorance and
> thinking "we don't need their contributions anyway, so let's just mock
> them and move on."
>

I'm just extra grumpy today.

First, the doc has what Steve requested already, so the high level
snarkiness isn't helpful.
Second, the doc isn't done, but there was no feedback on where in the doc
it isn't clear, so the message isn't helpful.
Third, you're reading too much into the first paragraph, which was copied
verbatim from the current guide.

That's what lead to my outburst.

Warner